Reflections on the How, Where and When from Tabor's blog on Hosea's Prophecy

Replies to This Discussion

Permalink Reply by Joanna Garrett on November 27, 2009 at 8:55pm

Hi there Sandra! What do you think "idolatry" and "harlotry" might look like when viewed from within? And what's does the "punishment" feel like?

X Joanna

Permalink Reply by Joanna Garrett on November 28, 2009 at 7:22am

In my experience it has been profoundly beneficial to look deep within and apply these questions. Another way to look at it might be to ask, what do my thoughts look like? Are my thoughts noble? Do my thoughts please YeHoWah? In my experience the number one idol we wrestle with is self aka ego. Self always wants to have the last word, always thinks its found godliness, but because that godlines is reflected through self it is nothing more than a form of godliness and lacks the power and love to transform the world.

How does the punishment feel? It feels like loneliness. It feels as though you are seperated from the love of neighbor and consequently the love and grace of YeHoWah.

X Joanna


Sandra Inglis said:

Hi Joanna,

I am not really sure what you mean by this question.

Idolatry to me is putting anything before YeHoWaH, such as putting the words of man before what is written in the Torah, holding on to beliefs which can not be proven in the Torah, and in the words of YeHoWaH spoken by His prophets in the Tanakh. Worshiping any one or any thing other than YeHoWaH. Harlotry, as it is spoken of in the book of Hosea, is having love for other gods, such as loving Yeshua rather than YeHoWaH. The punishment I believe is literal, not a feeling from within. If we continue in idolatry and harlotry then we will be punished, as described in the book of Hosea. If we turn from our idols and our harlotry, and ask YeHoWaH to forgive us, and turn to Him with all of our heart, then He will forgive us, and will not bring this punishment upon us.

I do not know if this has answered your question. If it has not then maybe you could clarify your question by giving an example of what you mean.

Shalom and Blessings,
Sandra.

Joanna Garrett said:

Hi there Sandra! What do you think "idolatry" and "harlotry" might look like when viewed from within? And what's does the "punishment" feel like?

X Joanna

Permalink Reply by Joanna Garrett on November 29, 2009 at 8:09am

Sandra, you said that beautifully. It's all making me think of Abraham though. Somewhere I read that his father was an idol maker and that he had worked in his father's shop making these various idols out of wood. This must have caused him to reflect quite deeply. He must have felt a great degree of loneliness as there was no opportunity for relationship with an idol, nor could he see himself reflected through the idol. Out of deep despair he smahes the idols and leaves home for the wilderness. I wonder if he expected to die? There was a time when I had the same thought, if I can't have a personal direct relationship with the one who created me then I'd rather die. This was a thought of total desperation as I was the mother of five children, but it was very clear to me at the time that without a knowledge of where I came from, without the knowledge of my divine brithright I would have nothing of value to give to my children. So Abraham left Egypt with no-thing, he had reached a place within himself of no-thing-ness, he had infact released all forms of identification or self labeling. It's interesting to me to see that the inner idols are so tricky to really get a handle on. But in the end, any label, any form of identification however righteous or noble is nothing but an idol before the only Holy One. The ego only survives as long it is attached in some way to a label. As an excercise try eliminating all the labels you have embraced as part of your identity, and keep in mind that Abraham didn't have a Torah in his hands, he came into the wilderness experience totally vulnerable, naked, perhaps even ready to die. I haven't thought about this before but this is now shedding new light on the binding of Issac......that's more to meditate on later.

X Joanna

Permalink Reply by Joanna Garrett on December 4, 2009 at 8:40am

Hezakiah, it seesm as though Sanadra has given a detailed account here to support the notion that Abraham would have had knowledge of YHWH based on his interaction with his ancestors namely Shem and Noah whom we are to suppose were still living during his life time. I wonder why he didn't just leave his father's house and go stay with one of them? It seems to me that Abraham wasn't satisfied with second-hand information about YHWH, he wanted direct knowledge, an encounter, a relationship. It's not at all difficlut to discern those teachers who have direct knowledge of YHWH from those who have, what I call, book knowledge. Those who have direct knowledge of YHWH operate from a different intellect - the intellect of the heart. Their relationship with YWHW is fluid and authentic and expresses itself as a fluidity and ease of realtionship with others. These Tsadiks (spelling may not be right) have a compelling energy that draws others towards them, an energy that is usually experienced by others as loving-kindess or garce. Typically these teachers are men or women of very few words, they seem rather to transmit the teaching through their "being." But when they do speak, they speak through the veil of the ego directly to the soul of the individual. A heart or soul that has become awakened to the knowlege of YHWH is tremendously powerful. Such a one has noble and righteous thoughts, and a thought alone can, when directed towards another, bring into reality YHWH's will on earth for that person.

I learned that Abraham pitched a tent in the desert after his encounter with YHWH. He pitched a tent and opened it up on all sides. This to me is an image of the condition of his heart, a heart that was wide, deep and open, a true reflection of the heart of YHWH. YHWH had made real to Abraham his Sonship during their encounter and promised him that he also would have many sons and daughters - a great nation. From that point in time Abraham became the spiritual father/teacher to all those who chose to enter into his tent and receive his teaching and pass it on through their own action of loving-kindness. But the actual receiving of the knowledge of "Sonship" is done by YHWH Himself, the teacher can only prepare the child/student and that is typically done intuitively as each individual is different and has different idols that need to be addressed and exposed. To me, this is what it means (at the heart level) to restore Abrahamic faith, bringing others into direct realtionship with YHWH.

X Joanna






Hezakiah Levinson said:

Hi Jo and Sandra.
No,the story is not in the Tanakh.It is Midrash, the non binding stories with a lesson.A quick take on it is when Avraham was a child and his father left him alone in the idol shop, Avraham smashed all the idols except the biggest one,which he placed the club into the idols arms.

When his father returned and got upset to see all the idols smashed,he asked Avraham,"Who smashed all the gods?"

Avraham pointed to the large one that he had placed the club in its arms.

His father exclaimed angrily, "It could not smash everything ! It is made out of wood and lifeless!"

To which Avraham replied,"Then why do you worship it?"